I’m a liberal. Always have been. That’s not going to change. It drives some of my family members crazy. Too bad. It happened sometime between the constant church attendance and required Bible readings. Somehow I got the idea that feeding, clothing and helping people find a safe place to live is a Christian value. I also learned that God could be quite brutal and abortion if done under the direction of God is, well, commanded. I also learned a lot of church law is capricious and arbitrary and is often manipulated by people who have a cherry picked agenda they want to advance. I have developed a more nuanced view of my faith since my childhood. Yep, I cherry pick the scriptures, too and tend to focus on the “nice” passages like the beatitudes or the chapter about love (1 Corinthians 13) and tend to leave the violent passages where Israel is directed to kill the Samaritans and Philistines less read. As a result I get a lot of grief from those who appoint themselves to be my shepherd.
I had a run in with a couple modern day Pharisees this week.
It started when I was at my sister’s house preparing a lesson plan on health care ethics and I was going to use the story in the news about the California law requiring Crisis Pregnancy Centers (among other reproductive care businesses) to clearly post:
“California has public programs that provide immediate free or low-cost access to comprehensive family planning services (including all FDA-approved methods of contraception), prenatal care, and abortion for eligible women. To determine whether you qualify, contact the county social services office at [insert the telephone number].”
Two Crisis Pregnancy Centers are suing the State of California for their first amendment right to lie to the women who visit their “clinics”. This acquaintance felt entitled to critique my lesson plans. He offered his unwanted advice saying this law is wrong and that any abortion prevented by these clinics was all to the good. He then went on to say that my “flawed” lesson plan was doing Satan’s work in defending this law. I essentially told the guy to buzz off as politely as possible; my class, my lesson plan and I changed the subject. Of course that didn’t work. He decided to preach at me why these Crisis Pregnancy Centers need to be protected in their “service to the lord”. I quickly realized that I was not going to be able to finish my lesson plan in peace and ended up manufacturing a reason to leave and started to do so.
As I was leaving, he accused me of lying about needing to leave and then went into a tirade about how he hates liars completely oblivious that his rant about lying was instigated by his defense of lying Crisis Pregnancy Centers. I was amused, but I wasn’t going to engage in any more conversation with him either and continued to look for my keys and purse. Then, he, get this, tells me I shouldn’t leave until he’s finished talking to me, that as a man of the lord it’s important that I receive his instruction. I smiled at him. (Someone long ago told me that woman get farther when they smile. It often works; so, I continue to do it.) Through my smile I said, “You know, being polite is rarely a bad choice and that is what I was doing. You aren’t taking the hint, so I’m going to say something not so polite, if not rude. I am going to the store to get things I was planning to get today. That’s no lie. I am not going to take any instruction from you, so you should stop now before you embarrass yourself more than you already have.” I could see my sister behind him rolling her eyes.
At that point Mr. Wolverton walked past her into the room and started to say something before this man interrupted demanding that he tell me to listen to him. That was a mistake because Mr. Wolverton has never liked this guy very much. He looked at him and said, “I have no problem with my wife ignoring anything you say,” then without missing a beat, after delivering that bucket of ice water, he turned to me and said, “I need you to take me back to our room. I have a date with the back nine”; which was weird because Mr. Wolverton doesn’t play golf. I went with it. As we were driving to where we were staying, I asked about the golf. “No, I made an appointment to learn how to play golf. James plays golf and he wants me to join him sometime. The resort has free classes, so I’ll give it a whirl. You can go back and spend time with your sister.” then he realized the likelihood of that and continued, “By the way, isn’t that the guy who pretty much forced his 16 year old daughter to have an abortion?” I sighed, “Yes, but we aren’t supposed to know about that”. Mr. Wolverton snorted something that seemed to sound a lot like, “asshole”.
During dinner with my sister that night, my sister chastised us for how we treated her friend. Over the years, I’ve realized people are seldom all good or all bad. We tend to have many layers and this man has been very helpful to my sister since her cancer diagnosis throughout her treatment. I am grateful to him for what he does for her and say so regularly to him. What neither she nor he understands, however, is that I no longer blindly accept teachings from self-appointed pastors. and said so to my sister. She understood and that would have been the end of it, but this guy sent me links to this self-appointed pastor’s writings about why lying can never be justified in the eyes of the lord (he even rationalizes away Rahab’s lies). Anyway, I decided to see if this guy really believed in what he writes and sent him an email. Why? cuz I was still putting together an ethics lesson about lying Crisis Pregnancy Centers. So, I sent this email and I’m ok with you all giving me grief over my Christian faith. To be fair I didn’t give this guy any of the back story you just read.
I read with interest your updated post about Christians and lying. It’s very informative. I'm a life long Christian who continues to fellowship with other Christians but have over the years become less and less comfortable with most churches. Specifically the ones that advocate "doing what it takes" to promote the Christian lifestyle.
I was wondering if you have shared this viewpoint that lying is always wrong with people who staff Crisis Pregnancy Centers, or if you have a view point on the new California law that requires Crisis Pregnancy Centers to post truthful disclaimers in their waiting areas.
I'm also wondering if you feel the same way about politics where we disregard the many admonitions in the scriptures to care for the orphans, widows and the poor and then lie about it when our politicians say it is Godly to eliminate food programs like WIC and SNAP and health programs like Medicaid and Medicaid expansion. Clearly having our tax dollars do God's work without a Christian auditor passing judgement (again, something the scriptures tell us not to do) is a wonderful way to do God's work. Having a government worker forbidden by law to eliminate people from programs based upon race, religion, gender and poverty would fulfill scriptural admonitions. It would eliminate the bias of those who would say things like, "OK, this person should get food stamps, and this one is OK, too; but not this guy, he's just lazy. He won't work, so he shouldn't eat." On the surface that might look acceptable, but maybe if we dug deeper we'd find a man who suffers from Lupus or maybe is bi-polar and can't afford effective medical treatment. How far does your anti-lying message go? Does it address hypocrisy?
Anyway, I'm curious how deep your conviction is about Christians lying; because, let me tell you it's not getting through to the people I worship with. When I go to church these days, I end up in the back, cringing at every hateful statement coming out of the legalistic pulpit. If I hear another person on their second marriage after 3 failed outside of marriage romances goes off on gay marriage; I'm going to challenge their lies and direct them to this posting. If I hear another "Christian" tell me the lies in Crisis Pregnancy Centers are acceptable in the eyes of God, I'll send them here.
Now, you could be thinking I'm an internet troll, but no, I'm not. I am a Christian who is really revolted by the likes of the Duggars, the Vitters, Steven Furtick, Ted Haggard, Paul Ryan, Bristol Palin (her mother, too) and more who promote the hypocritical way over a valid God led life.
He responded.
I was laughing because many of the things you said were funny in your description of being fed up. :)
I can't tell how I should respond to this because many of your points seem to be questioning political aspects, rather than foundational concepts. Those would be better answered when I finally get around to doing an expose on economics and the Bible. I can only answer your email with the following verses:
These six things doth the LORD hate: yea, seven are an abomination unto him: A proud look, a lying tongue, and hands that shed innocent blood, An heart that deviseth wicked imaginations, feet that be swift in running to mischief, A false witness that speaketh lies, and he that soweth discord among brethren.
-Pro 6:16-19
He didn't say "most" false witnesses, or "most" lying tongues.
Ok, lying is bad, but he didn’t answer my question about lying Crisis Pregnancy Centers, so i tried again, and I wan’t nice.
Hi,
I'm glad that my questions make you laugh. My job as a health care ethics instructor often gets my students who dread the class, but I do my best to keep my lesson plans real as well as amusing. So many of my students think their faith is something they only pull out on their weekly holy day and philosophical dilemmas are for discussions over a meal; but rarely impact their day to day work lives. One thing about health care ethics is that you deal with right and wrong every day you go to work. This week I will be focused on the California law targeting the lies inherent in Crisis Pregnancy Centers. Your layered response is illuminating in that you call on God's word to specify what God hates, but you still won't call out the deception of Christians doing those hateful deeds for "righteous reasons". It seems you have washed your hands of taking an ethical stand. It's good to know the Pontius Pilate response still works.Next you'll be telling me Christians aren't perfect, just forgiven.Got it.
Maybe I wasn’t clear enough about lying Crisis Pregnancy Centers in this retort and it confused Mr. Johnson. I did find his response very illuminating in terms of what he stands for.
I don't know what accusations you're trying to make -- I wish you would be more clear. I don't mind accusations, what I mind are VAGUE accusations, so please be direct and specific on what you're accusing me of, or go find someone else to contact because I really don't have time for this.
You're asking me if Christians can sin for righteous reasons? Why would that be a question? What Scripture could you possibly have to back up something like that? If the Lord God says it, then it's truth -- it doesn't matter what you or I want to believe about it, and I'm still puzzled at exactly what it is you want from me, or why you contacted me in the first place.
Have you ever listened to any of our teachings, or did you just read one thing and then contact me as if you know everything I say and do? After all the exposes I've done, perhaps it would be Biblical to listen to teachings first, and check out some other topics we have available before answering:
He that answereth a matter before he heareth it, it is folly and shame unto him.
-Pro 18:13
There's an article you can read if you're interested about what are called "false converts:"www.creationliberty.com/... -- That's the entire premise behind Christ's parables, and He said that Himself. That's probably the first problem you're dealing with if you're running into liars who don't repent.
Just because I don't have articles written out on every specific topic and instance that you personally want, does not give you Biblical precedence to start accusing me of a lukewarm position, which is what you were implying, but wouldn't say simply and directly. If you want Christian information put out on those specific topics you mentioned, then you start up your own ministry and start writing, then we'll have two people working on these projects instead of one; there's a lot of work to do, and I'm only one man.
If your next letter is like the last one, you won't hear from me again because I don't need the railing attitude, especially this week.
Not rendering evil for evil, or railing for railing: but contrariwise blessing; knowing that ye are thereunto called, that ye should inherit a blessing.
-1Pe 3:9
I pray the Lord Jesus Christ would bless you and your family with all your needs (and then some) throughout the coming week. I pray you have a wonderful day.
Oh, dear. Let me be clear. My original question to you was about Crisis Pregnancy Centers and how they lie to women and if you approve of those lies. I wanted to know if your posting about lying also applies to these "Christian" organizations. I wanted to know what you think of lying to women telling them that if they have an abortion, they will get cancer or commit suicide. Both have no basis of fact or truth. Your response didn't address this original query.
That's not vague.While I waited for you to respond a second time, I looked around your site and saw the posting about the :"dangers" of vaccines and as a health care professional and professional educator, I thought I'd give it a look. I inadvertently fell upon my answer. Wow, at best, that article has a lot of inaccuracies. At worst, it's full of lies. Either way, I got my answer. You are OK with spreading misinformation.That's ok, God still loves you.First of all there are thousands of studies that show the effectiveness of vaccines. You can find bunches of them at Pubmed.gov. Vaccines don't get FDA approval unless they can prove the negative, which is a daunting task if you are a researcher. Even the Amish community is coming around on vaccines since the outbreak of nearly 400 cases of the measles occurring in Ohio last year. Measles isn't that bad of a disease, unless you are the 1 in a millionth case where you go blind or deaf because of a complication to measles. As to autism the best way to increase your chances of having an autistic kid is to already have an autistic kid (ups the chances by something like 8400%). Autism is more correlated to advanced parental age at the time of conception than to vaccines. You'll get more mercury from eating a single serving of swordfish than you will in a vaccine. None of the childhood vaccines have Thimerosal and haven't for over a decade. The only one with Thimerosal is the trivalent flu vaccine which children don't get. My grandmother was a Polio survivor who died of Post-Polio Syndrome. I have a cousin who is a Polio survivor battling Post-Polio Syndrome. It's obvious that you are too young to remember these diseases that devastated communities as recently as the 1950s.The U.S. government has taken on all liability for injuries due to vaccination in the U.S. They track every negative outcome regardless of it being associated with the vaccine - even deaths due to car crashes are listed. The government does pay out on vaccine related claims, but it's one person out of something like 100 million vaccinations - very low odds of having a devastating consequence due to a vaccination. Most consequences are tender skin at the vaccination site for a few days or maybe some sniffles. Yes, some people should not be vaccinated and their doctors know who they are. (Generally people with immune disorders, those on chemotherapy and very young babies.) The rest of us need to roll up of sleeve and take the shots. It's the best thing for our community.So, no you don't need to take time out of your busy day to respond. I think I got what I needed to know from perusing your web site. You could, however, benefit greatly by talking to people who believe in both God and science. I saw your off hand comment on evolution and geesh. I mean, to think God created this beautiful universe without a metaphorical screwdriver is silly. We don't need to be afraid of what science tells us as God created the physical laws of the universe. We don't have to be worried about theories like evolution. The miracle is that it seems to work, but it's just a theory; not a proven fact. Anything else left to rot, well, rots. I don't have to disbelieve a theory to believe in God. Even the current Pope gets that one.And thank you. I learned a lot about your organization, mind set, patience and general attitude toward people you don't know.And I also thank you for your prayers and will add you and yours to my prayers as well,In Christ, all is possible.
Ok, that last reply from me was a bit saccharine, but I did add him to my prayer list and yes; I still pray. That reply is how us liberals get the label of smug and I should have been more compassionate — but man, this exchange was fun. Here’s some stuff on vaccinations for cross reference to the clap trap he posted and augment what i wrote in my emails to him — there are about 10 million doses given to children every year, plus about 170 million+ flu shots, plus who knows how many pneumonia, DTP, shingles, Hep A and Hep B shots are given to adults — that’s why I say it’s like 1 out of 100 million doses. That said, I should have stayed on the safe side and said “1 out of 10 million”. so ooops, my bad. Those are still great odds. Now, onto measles. I messed up. I should have said 2 out of every 1,000 cases of measles die from complications of the disease, Vaccinations are still the cheapest way to treat a devastating disease — by prevention.
I have to admit, I loved his final response. If he were more honest he would have written eff you, or something like that.
Then you go start your own ministry and teach those things any way you want, and you go tell everyone how wrong I am. I'll stick with Scripture, research, and evidence. Have a wonderful day.
After his “screw you” response, I looked over his anti-government stances and got quite the education. He doesn’t believe in following tax laws and has submitted to no ordination authority. I am in awe of his admonition to follow scriptural law, but disregard his country’s laws he finds to be inconvenient. His shoddy research and what he calls “evidence” is breath takingly scary. He doesn’t have a preacher’s license, a theology degree nor does he claim to be ordained. I know he would not put down in words that lying Crisis Pregnancy Centers are morally wrong, he’s got a bunch of suckers sending him money and his theology is pretty typical of the Kim Davis set. This is the kind of guy, my sister’s friend looks to for faith advice. This is typical of many people who profess Christianity. This is anti-intellectualism at it’s lying worst.
This is why I am no longer nice to overbearing religious types who say things like my sister’s friend said to me or guys like this who write irresponsible, dangerous advice dressed up as it were a religious mandate. This is why I take a vocal pro-choice stance and rather harshly defend not just reproductive rights, but women’s rights, too. This is why I am for SNAP, WIC, the ACA, Medicare for all, immigration reform, a stronger EPA and less powerful corporations. I am uninterested in living under a theocracy and shudder to think what a theocrat perverting their religion could do to the U.S. of A. I get a sad when people call me an apostate or worse and condemn my compassion for women who seek birth control, abortion, freedom from overbearing fathers, partners and brothers. They feel entitled to judge me and audit my life’s choices. Well, back at ‘em. I find many a Christian zealot’s hate and intolerance to be quite intolerable, too.
If you are still with me this far into this blog post let me give you the epilogue. I had a great class on health care ethics. They did not get the back story at the beginning of this blog post and they didn’t get as much of the email exchange. My students were engaged and found the entire story about lying Crisis Pregnancy Centers, the California law and the self-appointed pastor’s inability to write the words that Crisis Pregnancy Centers that lie to their clients is wrong; totally fascinating. They found the misinformation at Creation Liberty Evangelism scary. They walked away engaged and enlightened. Most importantly, they took away the concept that misinformation is both harmful and unacceptable. That’s what I call a good class.